We Are Going to Have to Live Here With Each Other | The Ezra Klein Show

This is an episode in two parts. First, my thoughts on Charlie Kirk’s murder, now that I’ve had a few days to process it, and to see the unfolding reactions and responses on both sides. Then a conversation with Ben Shapiro — one that was recorded shortly before Kirk’s assassination, but that has a different significance after it. 0:00 My reaction after Charlie Kirk's murder 11:37 Lions and Scavengers — and how we got here 25:48 Key moments in Obama's presidency that radicalized conservatives 42:36 Scavengers on the left and the right 1:11:23 Shapiro's view on Trump 1:21:17 Signs of Trump's executive overreach 1:28:16 Oh sh*t moment 1:41:46 Trump on immigration 1:47:48 Is Trump just the tip of the iceberg? 1:56:28 Book recommendations Read the full transcript here: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/16/opinion/ezra-klein-podcast-ben-shapiro.html Watch more on @EzraKleinShow Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at ezrakleinshow@nytimes.com. You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.html