Naomi Klein on Trumpism and Our Age of ‘Unlikely Bedfellows’ | The Ezra Klein Show

Naomi Klein saw where our politics was headed before most people on the left. Her 2023 book “Doppelganger: A Trip Into the Mirror World” is hard to describe. But among other things, it traces the new coalitions Klein saw forming on the right, the ways they were co-opting issues long associated with the left, and finding huge audiences and influence outside existing institutions. The people and coalitions that Klein wrote about run our world now. We are all living in the mirror world. As she put it, it’s “doppelgangers at the wheel.” So I wanted to have Klein on the show to help understand how that happened, what the left failed to see at the time and the lessons the left should take from it now. As Klein told me: “The thing about doppelgangers is, in literature, they’re always a message telling you a warning: You have to look at yourself. There’s something about yourself that you’re not seeing.” Note: We recorded this episode before the war in Iran. 0:00 Intro 2:35 Doppelgangers and the mirror world 6:35 “No Logo” 9:45 Naomi Wolf and the pandemic realignment 20:46 The problem with “mute/block” politics 29:47 Steve Bannon’s Epstein Problem 32:55 Fascism 43:52 Diagonalism 47:47 R.F.K. Jr.’s appeal 56:50 A.I. populism 59:12 The big questions in the age of A.I. 1:07:42 Building a more welcoming left 1:22:31 Book recommendations Read the full transcript here: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/03/20/opinion/ezra-klein-podcast-naomi-klein.html Watch more on @EzraKleinShow Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at ezrakleinshow@nytimes.com. You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.html